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Miss.ChatterBox
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Edited by Julia_Katina - 9/5/2013, 20:16
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butterfly-fly .
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Ok, may main problem is - he broods too much! FA is a nice actor I believe but I don;t quite get why from all range of emotions she is choosing mostly brooding, srsly, Stefan Salvatore from TVD has nothing on brooding compared to this guy.
Another thing I must complain, that he is romanticized too much. I understand it's the second main lead in the series after Pope, but since season one I'm waiting and waiting for him to do something crazy irrational, like kill someone who was not a total d-bag, but this is not happening.. -
Miss.ChatterBox .
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CITAZIONEI understand it's the second main lead in the series after Pope, but since season one I'm waiting and waiting for him to do something crazy irrational, like kill someone who was not a total d-bag, but this is not happening.
And that's where you are wrong, darling: he's definitely the main lead, according to the fans -read that on Tumblr like yesterday I think. What amazes me is that I hear they keep calling a ruthless sociopath when... actually I see no ruthlessnes in him. XD He has always a good reason for killing, never attacks first but he's a protector. It's like they want to make him a grey character and instead they end up depicting him both white and black (or at least attempt to), making a mess.
The very fact that they gave syphilis to Juan it's like stating Cesare isn't the promiscuous kind of guy (when he actually had ten sons AT LEAST) and therefore only beds women he loves like Ursula andHe's more a Romantic hero than the Reinassance man, in my eyes.SPOILER (clicca per visualizzare)Lucrezia.
He does not scare me. Not in the "bo!" way, I mean the real Cesare must have been the type that could make you shake with a meaningful look. I just don't get that vibe from Francois' Cesare, even though the plot looks to aim that way in some parts.. -
Julia_Katina .
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I don't like very much François' Cesare. I don't like the actor - according to my personal taste he is not a handsome man, and he doesn't look like the real Cesare - and I don't like the character, as he was scripted by Neil Jordan.
Neil presents him like the perfect son and the perfect man, the most clever and brave. But is it the truth? Well, he's not a stupid, a wild destroyer like his brother Juan, but is it enough to be the wonderful character that all the fandom loves?
I don't think.
Cesare isn't the best for his qualities. His the best 'cause there is not no one who is worthy of note. His enemies are so full of flaws to border on the ridiculous: they're ugly, stupid, evil, coward. And he's the hero among them. But the François' Cesare would not be able to survive with his mediocrity in the world of Tom Fontana: his opponents would have destroyed him.. -
butterfly-fly .
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Same here, Lu! I'm amazed at all the dirty work does Mikoletto and there is always a good reason for that. This Cezare is more of romantic hero than pretty much every other hero in my favorite shows. For Gods sake, the real Cezare was not that bland! He was far from being a hero.
It doesn't help that they mess up all his story big time ( but that's a blame on the show as whole), they paled Juan ( who I really pitied in this version) to make Cazare look better. and with Lucrezia? Сould it have taken him any longer to understand what she was aiming at? Guy, take a hint. I'm sure the real Cezare was not that shy with women. Well, Ok, I'm still waiting for him to go full psycho! 2.5 season, it's about time!. -
Julia_Katina .
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I'm sure the real Cezare was not that shy with women. Well, Ok, I'm still waiting for him to go full psycho
Lol, he was not. XD I think he was rather proud of his - real or presumed that it was - sexual prowess, like all the Borgias at the bottom. It's s likely he raped Caterina Sforza, maybe even Dorotea Malatesta Caracciolo.. -
butterfly-fly .
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QUOTEI don't like very much François' Cesare. I don't like the actor - according to my personal taste he is not a handsome man, and he doesn't look like the real Cesare - and I don't like the character, as he was scripted by Neil Jordan.
I don't find him attractive either, Ornella, and I seriously question his acting choices in portraying the character.QUOTECesare isn't the best for his qualities. His the best 'cause there is not no one who is worthy of note. His enemies are so full of flaws to border on the ridiculous: they're ugly, stupid, evil, coward. And he's the hero among them. But the François' Cesare would not be able to survive with his mediocrity in the world of Tom Fontana: his opponents would have destroyed him.
Yes, exactly! It's like there are not other smart and honorable men on these series. What they did with Juan to redeem Cezare of killing him is just..well..nonsense. Govanni Sforza is just an ugly abuser who deserved death as well, Ursula's husband apparently also in this department. Did he kill anyone else? He is so composed...I don't feel any internal struggle in him and mostly lack of any emotions in general.. -
Julia_Katina .
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I don't feel any internal struggle in him and mostly lack of any emotions in general.
Yes. Caesar was reduced to the first class, the boy is not appreciated enough by his father and the young man who loves easily (for example the story with Ursula). His torments do not exist for real, they're pale shadows. And he's also dominated by Lucrezia, literally.. -
butterfly-fly .
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QUOTEAnd he's also dominated by Lucrezia, literally.
OMG, the whole 3x02 and 3x03 went like this:
L: Сezare, I'm hot, my fiance is a virgin, can you do me a solid and hook up with me?
С: Oh, no, Lucrezia, I think it's a terrible idea. No, no, no....
L: I suddnly don't trust you
C: *kiss*
L: Finally!
C: I'm so sorry Lucrezia that's nit what I meant
L: Well, I'm naked in your bedroom now, so you kind of have to...
C: All right, all right! Persistant women scare me. -
Julia_Katina .
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XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD . -
Miss.ChatterBox .
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CITAZIONEL: Сezare, I'm hot, my fiance is a virgin, can you do me a solid and hook up with me?
С: Oh, no, Lucrezia, I think it's a terrible idea. No, no, no....
L: I suddnly don't trust you
C: *kiss*
L: Finally!
C: I'm so sorry Lucrezia that's nit what I meant
L: Well, I'm naked in your bedroom now, so you kind of have to...
C: All right, all right! Persistant women scare me
Let's not forget this man had 10 CHILDREN at LEAST in real life. Watching the episodes I felt entirely confused by the developement of this incest thing -firstly it was out of nowhere, since last season Lucrezia was happily en rout to fall for Alfonso and then this season had a 360° turn and became a sex addict like she haven't seen one D FOR AGES.
Secondly, let's analyse the scenes how they were played: firstly, Cesare all but tells here he loves her and pratically breaths into her mouth. Then, she decides she wants sex and does the whole bed-thing when Cesare positively looks like a terrified prey. The episode next, he kisses her and she CRIES because of that. And then he looks SO SURPRISED when she goes on to bed him.
I mean: either you are the prey or the hunter, make up your mind! I could see one would be WTF EVER if their sister showed herself naked out of nowhere, but you can't be the one initiating things and then look like a terrified deer.. -
butterfly-fly .
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I;m sorry I probably should not have joked about that, I'm a lawyer, I don;t know when to shut up sometimes:)))
I agree this whole development was laughable at least. Cezare was mostly inconsistent, after he made the first step Lucrezia had to practically force him to...well, continue what he started. I saw a couple of vids on YT on their pairing before this season, but I actually thought they were...without a solid foundation. The whole situation is hella confusing.
Lets say on Borgias C and L also had like 2-3 scenes before the bedroom one in the finale, and yeh, the finale scene was awkward with Perotto behind the curtain and all, but that I could believe caught in a moment those two def very passionate young people, who had just experienced some very traumatic family moment could just break loose and go for it.
Oh, I guess I know what happened with Alfonso's sl this season - like any other man on this show he had to be tainted to make Cezare look like a better person. I guess his inability to defend Lucrezia and her son before his uncle was ultimately a big turn off for Lucrezia.
I really-really doubt this version of Cezare would have 10 children...they would probably be all Micholetto's, oh, wait
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Miss.ChatterBox .
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CITAZIONEI really-really doubt this version of Cezare would have 10 children...they would probably be all Micholetto's, oh, wait
*dies*CITAZIONEOh, I guess I know what happened with Alfonso's sl this season - like any other man on this show he had to be tainted to make Cezare look like a better person. I guess his inability to defend Lucrezia and her son before his uncle was ultimately a big turn off for Lucrezia.
The thing about incest is that they never really give you the chance to ship any of the two with somebody else. Lucrezia's men were either wimps or monsters, Cesare only had Ursula, who was some sort of foreshadowing for Lucrezia's married life. Every possibile option either gets killed off or runs away and somehow they just can't compare with the protagonists.
This seasonSPOILER (clicca per visualizzare)for Cesare we have Charlotte, who I'm told is super bamf but not interested in him romantically and only wants to be his sex buddy, basically.
Lucrezia is the only one for him and that's it. He's not even promiscuous, he's the purest of all the Cardinals and he's not even a Cardinal anymore.
Everything he does he's good at, either in the Church or outside. And as you said, every other man in the show is a good a nothing compared to him. They tell us he has flaws but where are they? XD There was the time he didn't tell Juan an army was coming at him to aid Caterina Sforza and that was it. I don't know what I see but I definitely can't see a sociopath in him.. -
butterfly-fly .
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QUOTEThe thing about incest is that they never really give you the chance to ship any of the two with somebody else. Lucrezia's men were either wimps or monsters, Cesare only had Ursula, who was some sort of foreshadowing for Lucrezia's married life. Every possibile option either gets killed off or runs away and somehow they just can't compare with the protagonists.
That's esp weird, because correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought there was a word from Nail Jordan somewhere in S1 he he does not intend to go this rout at all. That he is all against the idea of exploring this side of relationships.QUOTEEverything he does he's good at, either in the Church or outside. And as you said, every other man in the show is a good a nothing compared to him. They tell us he has flaws but where are they? XD There was the time he didn't tell Juan an army was coming at him to aid Caterina Sforza and that was it. I don't know what I see but I definitely can't see a sociopath in him
Agreed! He is rather boring both in romantic and political aspect. Uninspiring. So not the Cezare we are reading about.. -
Miss.ChatterBox .
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CITAZIONEThat's esp weird, because correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought there was a word from Nail Jordan somewhere in S1 he he does not intend to go this rout at all. That he is all against the idea of exploring this side of relationships.
The general idea in here is that they could only go on with implied incest for some time. Also, the general audience follow the show mostly for Cesare and Lucrezia and incest is what's raising this season's rating from dropping six feet under, I hear. Fans wanted to see it happening and you can only let down their expectation so much. In an interview Francois also stated Neil didn't want to go that way but suddenly this season he told them to just go on with the incest thing.CITAZIONEAgreed! He is rather boring both in romantic and political aspect. Uninspiring. So not the Cezare we are reading about.
It's not that I want to see him kill for fun, don't get me wrongactually that would be pretty IC, though.It's just... you can't always BE right, can you? And he almost never fails. Last thing he couldn't do that I remember was saving Ursula but simply because he couldn't have known French were headed that way. In any other case, he's kind of Incestman -as opposed to Superman LOL- always there to save the day..
![The House of Borgia [all about Renaissance, the Family - Da Vinci's Demons, Reign & more]](https://i.imgur.com/QY4IMuw.png)
The House of Borgia [all about Renaissance, the Family - Da Vinci's Demons, Reign & more] - x The Borgias
- x personaggi
»Cesare Borgia (François Arnaud)“I was born with a stain. A mark. Like the mark of Cain." |
